Blog - Read the Bill: Illegal Immigrants Are NOT Covered

Now…have you exercised your freedom to actually investigate the backgrounds of these czars or did someone just tell you that and you believed them? I think it would really help prove your point if you could show factual information that supports your claims that Obama is lying and that the czars are communists. And because you are a free American, you can actually look things up for yourself. So tell me…have you exercised your right to see something with your own two eyes before you believe it?

Human being had tried to evolve for million of years, many people forget that the most important point in evolution is ethics. There’s nothing better than ethics. And this important word must be part of human existence. Human ethics is not a simple idea, human ethics could be applied not only to individuals but to human institutions as the STATE. When is gonna be the time when human institutions will be inspired by ethics not only for economy in many countries?. I hope some day.

The reference to Section 246 in the original blog totally mis-construes the contest of the language. The Subtitle C—Individual Affordability Credits. It has nothing to do with eligibility for benefits. This section does appear to deny Affordability Credits to persons “not lawfully” in the US (does not include anchor babies)but has no impact whatsoever on whether or not an illegal can purchase or be covered by the subject health benefits.

I think the other quoted sections, unqualified or restricted by clear language to the contrary, necessarily include illegal aliens as persons eligible to receive benefits under the bill.

excuse me but what you’ve proven is that illegals will receive benefits:

promulgate such regulations as are necessary or appropriate to insure that all health care and related services (including insurance coverage and public health activities) covered by this Act are provided (whether directly or through contractual, licensing, or other arrangements) WITHOUT REGARD TO PERSONAL characteristics extraneous to the provision of high quality health care or related services.

REGULATIONS shall be incorporated WITHOUT REGARD TO PERSONAL CHARACTERISTICS i.e. IMMIGRATION STATUS OR LACK THEREOF In other words -illegals cannot be denied, will not be denied.

Pres Obama has stated that he will REMOVE the loophole that exists enabling illegals to access taxpayer health insurance..proving that Joe was right. At the time Obama insisted illegals would not be covered – he was misleading/fibbing/lying or just plain ignorant of what is in his HC Bill.

Health care already costs Americans in excess of 3 trillion dollars annually. For the most part, we are unaware of that cost, because so many parasitic corporations split that cost/profit amongst themselves.

“This is ultimately a battle between individual freedom versus The State. Being a proud American, I will always choose freedom and liberty over tyranny. "

This is why new laws are passed every year at the insurance company’s behest? “Think of the children” is enough to have the most idiotic laws passed. Seat belt, air bag, and helmet laws are a good place to start. Years ago, I had the freedom to choose whether I would wear a seatbelt – today, tyrannical insurance companies have succeeded in passing laws that mandate a policeman ticket me.

“but not by denying health care to immigrants and their children.”

Any rational government would be prepared to capture illegals when they applied for benefits. Illegals are by definition criminals. Requesting medical care that will be paid for by taxpayers only adds to their criminal status.

Mandate that the doctor will NOT be paid for treating criminals, give the doctor a phone number, and when a criminal shows up for treatment, he just calls the cops.

Oh yeah – let’s stop this nonsense that prohibits a city cop from questioning an obvious illegal…….

Not all of us are so much in love with that “capitalistic” bit. All that nonsense about “government death panels” is a dramatization of what we already have. Today, “corporate death panels” decide whether I may have an operation. Today, those corporate panels leach money out of working people for decades, just to cast them away when they no longer look profitable. That is what “capitalism” gets us.

Actually, I think that “we the people” will make it happen, despite your rhetoric. Oh yeah – I think the government is quietly moving ahead with e-verify. Give me a card, and give me the same sort of insurance that I’ve been paying on for years – for my congress critters. I deserve it, thank you very much.

Get over your fear. Demoncrats are no worse than you neocons…..

“This president is depending on his opponents being too "gentlemanly""

No way. Obama got his political experience in Chicago – the land where senator’s seats are sold to the highest bidder. He knows there are no gentlemen in Washington. Obama didn’t even look excited or shocked when the redneck from S. Carolina called him a liar. Look at the video again – it’s almost a look of boredom. “Again? What’s with that trailer trash?”

Don’t tell us about gentlemanly behaviour – unless you’re referring to the common practice of making all the real deals behind closed doors so that Joe Sixpack can’t see what’s going on.

Joe Wilson owes America an apology, in addition to the apology that he owes congress.

i need a lot of shoes!!

The are here LEGALLY with Visas. Therefore they would be covered in the U.S.

Anonymous, Competition in healthcare is wishful thinking. Few people will go to the lowest bidder, because low cost often indicates a physician not able to attract patients or a hospital that skimps on cleanliness or technology. So the opposite will be true as the higher priced providers will be at an advantage.

On the insurance bureaucracy consuming 31% of our health care costs, that is found at www.pnhp.org, and it includes their high CEO and Executive salaries and bonuses, high shareholder profits, actuarial fees, gatekeeper costs, marketing costs and broker commissions, and even the lobbying costs and campaign contributions that they must pass on to the patient. It also includes the added billing personnel at the hospitals and clinics.

Anonymous, Competition in healthcare is wishful thinking. Few people will go to the lowest bidder, because low cost often indicates a physician not able to attract patients or a hospital that skimps on cleanliness or technology. So the opposite will be true as the higher priced providers will be at an advantage.

On the insurance bureaucracy consuming 31% of our health care costs, that is found at www.pnhp.org, and it includes their high CEO and Executive salaries and bonuses, high shareholder profits, actuarial fees, gatekeeper costs, marketing costs and broker commissions, and even the lobbying costs and campaign contributions that they must pass on to the patient. It also includes the added billing personnel at the hospitals and clinics.

Continued: The best system would eliminate the insurance bureaucracy, but with all of the cash flowing to the political campaigns that won’t happen. What people don’t realize is that these jokers take their orders from the industry and not their constituents.

What people don’t realize is that for the same dollars we are spending today we could provide first-class Cheney-care to 100% of the people. But our corrupt political system is standing in the way.

CongressCritter, I owned an independent diagnostic testing facility (IDTF) for 25 years before retiring. We provided mobile echocardiogram and cardiac monitoring services to hospitals and clinics. We did not see patients directly, only when referred to us. We competed with other IDTFs, but when we cut our costs and prices, none of that was ever seen by the patient. It only added to the profits of our customers, the clinics and hospitals.

And yea, under the House plan (HR3200) the power brokers (the insurance industry) will remain. The politicians have seen to that, because they gave $46 million in campaign contributions in 2008 alone. But the politicians care not what they did in the past, they want them still in the system in the future, because private companies can give campaign contributions and public entities like Medicare can’t.

What in God’s name did anyone learn from that speech? And discourse means written or spoken debate or a formal discussion or debate. That 48 minute waste of broadcasting power was a pep talk. Nothing was explained, nothing was expounded on. Just more of the same ole’ rhetoric being spouted as factual.

I agree it was inappropriate to comment in such a manner but don’t talk about “if blah blah blah happened when Bush was in office” as a matter of reality it is an impossibility to state what would have happened. You can say it might have happened or probably would have happened .

Right, because we all carry our passports with us at all times. I thought you Republicans Libertarians were anti-government-issued-ID-card-which-must-be-presented-upon-demand?

Oh, right, that only applies to polling places…

Requiring insurance and paying for it are two different things.

BTW, do you guys remember this? http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2009/09/10/flashback_democrats_boo_bush_at_2005_state_of_the_union.html

It would be a double-standard, IF Democrats had any standards. ;]

You and the bloggers on those sites are taking what Obama says at face value. I think you’re either misinterpreting the bill OR not reading it at all. Obviously this site is reading the bill, as you’ve posted excerpts from it, but I think you’re failing to see the obvious holes that were left open, which anyone could take advantage of such a health care plan. The terminology of the bill plays a big role:

“Nonresident aliens would be exempt from the required coverage, but undocumented immigrants who live in the United States for a certain amount of time during the year would be classified as residents. “Thus, it would appear that unauthorized aliens who meet the substantial presence test would be required under HR 3200 to have health insurance…” -CNN (http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/08/27/health.care.immigrants/)

lol… They’re not tyrannies (just based off of socialist ideologies), but they’re pretty awful. ;P

More:

He’s hiring 40 czars (who we can’t/don’t vote for – many of which have communist/socialist backgrounds and radical ideologies), he has placed the responsibility of the census under the White House, he’s lied to our faces/television screens on a continuous basis; he and the representatives & senators in office are name-calling constituents, lying to our faces/television screens, denying townhalls, ignoring the complaints/arguments/debates of constituents, etc.

This is no longer a government of, by and for the people… the constituents no longer have a voice.

You don’t seem to get it. They’re supposed to be representative of the people – the people of this nation. You don’t need to take a biased poli-sci class, to understand how the government works, and to understand the fundamental values that have been in-place since the structuring of the government by our founding fathers. Read the constitution, read the declaration of independence, realize what the three branches of government are and what their uses are, and understand that this is a Democratic Republic based on the principle that it’s run by the people, for the people and of the people.

There’s a reason why Obama’s polls are slipping as fast as they are… because he’s got an abrasive and radical agenda, and the majority of Americans understand this.

Sad that you think European countries are totalitarian backwaters. Maybe it’s not “hate”, but the disinformation seems pretty malicious, unless you really think France, England, Sweden and Germany are awful tyrannies.

Perhaps the most salient verification that coverage is not included in H.R. 3200 is the fact that pro-migrant organizations and activists are echoing Rep. Wilson’s remark:

http://promigrant.org/diary/1003/news-highlight-but-obama-is-a-liar

And, for good measure, why don’t we throw in a prominent liberal blogger, saying it would be good if coverage was included (while acknowledging it’s not):

http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archives/2009/09/immigrants-and-health-care.php

To finish my statement:

There are several ways to save money, but with more competition in the market… you’ll be forced to offer the best value for the best price.

To address your concerns with executives: IF a CEO is responsible/ethical, the first place he’ll cut is his/her own salary. The establishment, reputation and profitability of his/her company is at stake. Those who go into business for themselves, yes, go in to hopefully make money, but also to do something they have an apt for doing… Typically, a responsible entrepreneur pays his employees first and his self last. They take care of their employees, and in so doing, they create a positive environment, where people enjoy their jobs and perform well. Performing well, increases customer base, which in turn increases profit. When profit is incremented, salaries go up, more employees are hired, and you’re able to pay yourself – wallah – success.

Of course, another option that executives take, is a restructuring of a company, where people lose jobs, titles are changed, responsibilities are shifted, etc.

Man… I should have signed up for an account. It’s really difficult to keep track of who’s posting what. ;P

Anyway, Jack… that defeats the purpose of competition in a free market economy. All you have to do is look at the car insurance companies. Look at competing plans, the massive campaigns to attract customers, etc. They all compete to offer the best value at the best price, which is what COULD happen to the health care industry in this country.

There’s always a risk involved with insurance, to the insurer. There’s always a chance someone might get into a car accident and total their car, but that shouldn’t stop them from offering the best value at the best price. If it happens, they’ll be covered, because logistically, not every person with insurance from that company is getting into an accident on the exact same day or thereabout.

The only way President Obama has any possibility of passing health care reform, is a commitment to remove illegal immigrants from gaining entrance to any public option? In the health care bill they must—PROVE—to the majority of the American People that—NO ILLEGAL FOREIGN NATIONAL—will be able to bleed the government extension in the package. An amendment to the 1000 page reform bill, must guarantee—IN THE WORDING— that a very thorough background identity check is performed on any applicant who applies? E-Verify would be a progressive identifier, with an initial examination of Social Security number in conjunction with Homeland Security Databases.

To complete the operation of E-Verification this PC application, must branch out across the country as a permanent tool in business and industry for every worker newly hired or long time employee. Thousands or even millions of illegal workers could be hiding in plain site in the workplace, as they have never been checked as a citizen or legal residency compliance? It also seems that the auditing of 1-9 forms around the country, that the federal authorities forget to mention that irregularities by employers only allows them to dismiss the applicant? The fact is that ICE raids have trailed off, so that any illegal workers—ARE NOT DEPORTED—they can move onto yet another workplace. Anybody who is suspected of being in this sovereign nation illegally should be detained and held for ICE inspection, not released into the public mainstream?